Thursday, April 22, 2010

Thirteen: Hunted

The next morning we all got up a little before the sun did, and I lent Cob a hand with the last pieces of metal that had to be loaded on the wagon while Sam and Berry got breakfast ready. It was a bright, clear day, good for travel. After we ate – it was good familiar ruinman’s fare, bread and bean soup and big mugs of chicory brew – Berry and I climbed on board the wagon and found places for our bags in among the metal, while Cob gave Sam instructions for the day and then swung up onto the seat in front and took the reins.

“Be a bit rough at first here,” Cob said over his shoulder as the horses started up the trail toward the road. “Hope you don’t mind.” He wasn’t lying, either. The wagon lurched and jolted its way up to the road, and Berry and I hung on as best we could. Finally we got onto the old road, and from then on it was pretty smooth going as wagons go. They say that the old roads used to be so smooth you could ride down one of them in one of their cars, faster than a horse can gallop, and not have to hang on to much of anything. I’m not sure I believe that; I’ve helped dig plenty of cars out of old ruins, and they all had handles on the inside for you to grab, and belts to keep you from being thrown out of your seat. Still, that’s what people say.

These days, of course, if a road’s still good enough to drive a wagon on it, that means either you’re very lucky or you’re on a road that’s been fixed up for the army not too long ago. We were lucky, or rather Cob was, because he had to get the metal from the old empty nuke out to buyers, and it would have been a mother to get done if there hadn’t been the road. As it was, Berry and I had to jump off a couple of times and help get the wagon across some difficult place or other.

Finally, though, we started passing farms, a few at first and then a lot of them, and the road got better in the rough sort of way that happens when country folk do it themselves. Some of the people in the fields waved to Cob, and he waved back, which surprised me; around Shanuga nobody but another ruinman will greet a ruinman, or give him the time of day. Then the fields gave way to houses and a scattering of shops around a big central market square, and we were in Lebna.

Cob drove the wagon straight to one corner of the market. There were a bunch of men sitting there playing cards, but they got up and put the cards away as soon as they saw Cob coming. Two of them were blacksmiths by the leather aprons they wore; I couldn’t place the rest, but I guessed they were craftworkers of one kind or another, looking for metal for their trades.

“Well now,” one of the blacksmiths said to Cob. “Got yourself some help, I see.”

He meant Berry and me, of course. “Nah,” Cob told him, “just a couple of ruinmen from Shanuga heading north.”

The whole bunch of them got very quiet, and I knew right then that word must have gotten out. The blacksmith who’d spoken turned to me, and said exactly what I thought he was about to say. “From Shanuga, eh? They say the ruinmen down there found something out o’ the usual.”

“News to me,” I told him. “What was it?”

“Some kind o’ paper about Star’s Reach.”

I used some hot language, then: “Come on.”

“That’s what they say.”

“Nothing like that turned up when I was there, but it’s been most of a month. Some folks have all the luck, I guess.”

I could see that the blacksmith didn’t believe a word of it, but he nodded after a moment, and went to look at Cob’s metal. Berry and I said our goodbyes to Cob and left him to his customers. There was a fair crowd there for the market, and plenty of sellers pitching everything from vegetables and ironwork to bolts of cloth and bottles of medicine, but we wove through the crowd got out of there just as fast as we could without seeming to hurry.

Lebna wasn’t that big of a town in the old days, and it’s a lot smaller now than it was; I’d spotted plenty of old concrete foundations in the pastures and open country we’d passed through on the way in. Still, the houses seemed to go on forever as Berry and I took a dirt road north out of town. It didn’t help that my mind was running full out the whole way. Word of the discovery couldn’t have gotten to Lebna without running down the Hiyo valley first. That meant that Luwul, where we’d hoped to cross the Hiyo River, would be full of the news, and so a likely place for trouble. We could go west or east and miss it, but I had no way of knowing which would be best, or whether either one might land us in an even worse place. That’s what ran through my mind, over and over again, while we kept walking and I tried not to imagine watchful eyes peeking out at us between the curtains of the houses we passed.

Finally we got into the farm country north of town, the houses got sparse, and loms out in the pastures turned their heads on their long necks to watch us go by. Forest filled the horizon like a green haze. once we got in among the trees, I knew, we’d have an easier time staying away from anyone who might decide to follow us, but they were still quite a ways off, and the road we were on wound from side to side as though it wasn’t in any kind of hurry to get where I wanted to go.

“Do you think—” Berry started, and then stopped; he’d seen the man up ahead just a moment after I did.

A farmer, for certain, or at least he looked like one; shirt and trousers of homespun, bare feet, straw hat, and a lazy look that could have had anything at all behind it. He could have been standing just like that, leaning up against a fence post, in the Tenisi hills where I was born. What got my hackles up, though, is that he just happened to be standing right where the road split into two, one branch going a little west of north, the other a little bit east.

“Afternoon,” I said to him as we came up to the fork.

“Afternoon,” he replied.

“D’you happen to know which road goes to Luwul?”

He nodded to the left hand fork. “That’s the one.”

“Thanks.”

“Sure thing. You two have a good day, now.”

We passed him by, and headed along the road to the left. Pretty soon it veered further left, then swung straight again on the far side of a clump of trees. I glanced back to make sure we were out of sight of the ford, and then around to make sure nobody else might be watching. “Now,” I said to Berry, “we figure out the fastest way to cut back across to the other road without being spotted.”

That’s what we did, too. A little further on a creek cut across the road; it had willows growing along the bank, all thick with leaves, and there weren’t any farmhouses or people in sight beyond it. As soon as we were past it, we ducked into the field and hurried across, staying close to the willows. It got us some mud on our boots, but a quarter of an hour later we were on the other road, and luck or Mam Gaia or something was with us; there was nobody else on the road just then, and the forest was close by.

As soon as we got under the trees, I said, “Okay, now we find a place to hole up for the rest of the day, someplace where we can see the road and not get seen.”

Berry took this in. “You think somebody’s after us.”

“I think there’s too good a chance of it. Those people at the Lebna market guessed what we’ve got with us. Bet you a mark to a mud-turtle, too, that that farmer wasn’t just standing there to hold up the fencepost.”

He thought about that, then grinned. “And he’ll send them down the road to Luwul.”

“If we’re lucky,” I said.

Rumble from the road ahead warned us, and we ducked off the road and hid in the bushes until the wagon rolled past. By the time it was gone, both of us had spotted a bit of gray concrete ruin on a low hill not far from the road, and once it was safe to move, we scrambled through the underbrush and climbed up to it. It wasn’t much, part of two walls rising out of four hundred years of dirt and fallen leaves, but there wasn’t any sign that other people were in the habit of going there, and it had a good view of the road down below. I went to take a look, saw the wagon rolling out of sight toward Lebna and a couple of farm folk heading toward a distant house

“Look at that,” Berry said from the other side of the ruin. I went over and looked where he was pointing, and damn if the other road wasn’t right out in plain sight away in the middle distance.

“You know,” he said after a moment, “I bet this is what Freddy felt like.”

Now of course I knew what he was talking about, but if anybody ever reads this, what’s the chance they’ll know the first thing about Freddy and Sam, and all the other people in the stories we tell in Meriga? Maybe they will, for all that. Plummer told me that all those stories came out of a big book that was written back in the old world, over on the other side of the ocean where the Arabs live now, and somebody whose name I don’t remember thought that whole book up out of his own head. Maybe he was right about that, but it seems like an awful lot for one person to think up.

Nobody I know ever got any of the stories out of a book, either, and no two storytellers tell them quite the same way. Of course there’s always the ring, and Goll and the black riders chasing Freddy all over the countryside, and the war and Doom Mountain and all, and then Ergon gets elected presden and everybody settles down happily; none of that changes. Still, I knew one storyteller who told it so that Ergon marries Erin the elf-woman, who he was in love with since he was a boy, and another who told it so that Ergon falls in love with Eywin and marries her, so Erin ends up getting together with Ferrem. To this day I can’t decide which version I like better, and if one of them’s in the book and the other isn’t, I’m not sure I’d want to know.

But Berry was right. No matter who tells it, one of the best parts of the story is when Freddy and his friends are ducking and running through the woods with the black riders hot after them, and he was right, too, that we might be doing the same thing before long.

It was right about then that I saw something moving along the other road, the one to Luwul the farmer sent us down. Trees got in the way, and then all of a sudden they came out into a clear patch: five riders on horses, riding hard. Farmers don’t ride that way, and I didn’t know of any reason why soldiers would be in the middle of Tucki when there was no fighting anywhere nearby. That didn’t leave a lot of options.

“There’s your black riders,” I said to Berry. He’d seen them, too, and watched them with wide scared eyes until they were out of sight.

28 comments:

John Michael Greer said...

Thanks for your patience! I've been in the middle of a large writing project -- "a mother of a job," as Trey would put it -- and time for other projects has been sparse. Still, I plan on getting the next installment under way shortly.

Rebecca said...

Ah, so glad you've resumed the telling... I will wait patiently for more, I swear it, but it will be difficult. Your story is so fascinating and timely and I love reading it! Thank you.

paulmilne said...

It's worth the wait. You know what book this reminds me of? Huckleberry Finn, and I mean that as a compliment. Something about the combination of the dialect speech, first person narrative and the journey through the same neck of the woods as Huck and Jim, being hunted etc. Also, very clever to bring in TLOTR like that, black riders indeed!

Antony said...

Thanks for the update!

I find it interesting that place names have evolved to be nearly unrecognizable, yet proper names from the old stories have more or less stayed the same.

Please, keep up the good work!

John Michael Greer said...

Rebecca, thank you!

Paul, that's high praise. Thank you also.

Antony, I considered muddling the names of the Tolkien characters, too, as they'd likely be rounded off the same way by time -- I recall another postcollapse SF novel in which a storyteller went around telling the tale of Prince Amulet, for example. Still, I wasn't at all sure how to do it and still make the names clearly recognizable by the modern reader. An interesting challenge!

nulinegvgv said...

JM Greer,

I find both your fiction and your nonfiction useful, entertaining and thoughtful. I read your work consistently.

It is with great admiration that I suggest that your most recent Tolkien reference is bad. 400 years later there is still a reference to Frodo? "Aragorn gets elected presden."?

I have greatly enjoyed reading _The Lord of the Rings_ at several times in my life. I am currently reading those stories to my children at night. Perhaps, in the Ecotechnic Future recycled stories of JRR Tolkien will still be recited by parents to their children but I must say that I think this is a stretch for your fictional work based on its setting.

I love what you’re doing- just trying to be helpful.

All the best,

Aaron

Antony said...

Come to think of it, we have no idea what language this is being written in. To Trey and company, modern English may sound as odd as Chaucer's Middle English does to us today. If the entire language was 'rounded off' or reduced as much as the place names have been, the entire story would be nearly unintelligible.

That being said Mordor could easily be corrupted into Murder (or vice-versa), while Gollum could easily be perverted into profanity (as in the 1960's era parody 'Bored of the Rings' did quite well).

Considering the popularity of the theatrical release of the movies, I wouldn't be surprised if Peter Jackson's version winds up becoming more popular than Professor Tolkien's. Theatrical adaptations would not be unlikely (they are in the works for the Hobbit, from what I understand), which may very well survive into Trey's time. If not, storytellers more familiar with that version, would tell it over the longer, more convoluted, literary version, just because it would work better with an audience, rather than the rather dry pontificating that occurred between the character/action sequences in the Cannon. Then again, I've seen clips of Benjamin Bagby singing Beowulf, where he even made genealogy look interesting, so it could be all in the presentation. Perhaps Tolkien could be made into a musical, A-la-Spamalot...

Regarding 'presden' Aragorn, how would Denethor be explained? A Regent is not the same as a Usurper, although such distinctions may be lost on an unsophisticated audience. Without which, how would one explain the conflict going on between Boromir's love for Gondor's traditons and his loyalty to his father ("Gondor has no Presden, Gondor needs no Presden")? This may be picking at nits, but it is essential for the overall story...

John Michael Greer said...

Nulinegvgv, I think it was Lincoln who said that you can't please all the people all the time; if you don't like that detail of the story, you don't like it. Still, I'd point out that the odds that stories about a Roman-British cavalry commander in the early sixth century CE would turn into the world's most famous legend -- we call him "King Arthur" these days -- were pretty steep.

Antony, as near as I can tell, the language Trey speaks is a direct descendant of modern English, with a lot of the sounds rounded off. The language he writes is a lot closer to modern English; it's not at all uncommon, especially when literacy is a minority skill, for changes in written language to lag centuries behind what's spoken.

As for Denethor and Boromir, I suspect that's one of the things that storytellers rework in their own ways. There have been times in Meriga's history where there wasn't a presden, or when there were two or more claimants for the title, so contemporary politics might well shape how those details of the stories got told.

James said...

JMG,

The story continues to be entertaining, and seeing your fictionalized vision of the future is fascinating.

Meanwhile, as to the Tolkien references, I read a post-apocalyptic novel in which the words of Bob Dylan were as revered as Shakespeare's works are today. The sci-fi film "Reign of Fire" also has a wonderful bit in it where people are performing live, the epic battle between Luke Skywalker and Darth Vadar.

It is extremely believable that some of our modern popular fiction with get passed down through the centuries ... and it is anyone's guess which stories will survive and which won't. Frodo is as good a guess as any, and better than most.

Don said...

So no copy of Tolkien's original LOTR survived? There's no laminated copy in the archives in Cincinnati?

:-)

John Michael Greer said...

James, I remember a piece of postapocalyptic SF titled The Texts of Festival, in which the city of Festival was inhabited by the distant descendants of thousands of hippies who had been in some rural location listening to their favorite bands when the boom came down. Every year there would be ritual performances where people would put on masks and costumes and strut around the stage with fake instruments, while scratchy recordings boomed out the sacred texts of Dhillon, Djeggar, and the great lizard king Morrizen. For its time, it was pretty plausible.

Don, there isn't one in the archives at Sisnadi; those are strictly government records. The college at Melumi has a copy, but only the scholars have access to the books there. I suspect there may be other copies tucked away in Gaian monasteries and a few private collections, and 500 years or so after Trey's time, somebody will find one and put manuscript copies into circulation, sparking a cultural revival...but that's not something Trey will ever hear about, of course!

Don said...

A cultural revival based on LOTR: how interesting! I wonder if they would try seeking a place where they could mine for mithril or forge elvish swords like Glamdring? Now that might be as interesting as searching for Star's Reach!

FARfetched said...

Given the state of affairs, I would expect that epic tales like LotR would become fodder for bards and other travelling entertainers cum news propagation agencies. Perhaps in the area that was once New England, they tell stories of Roland and his quest for a Dark Tower. But only JMG could tell us.

James, I remember that story with the Dylan lyrics. IIRC, it was a short story about some people who returned from the stars to find what they could and start cleaning up the mess.

Anyway, JMG, I know how those writing projects can absorb all your free time and then some. Here's hoping it bears fruit!

John Michael Greer said...

Don, my thought was more along the lines of the sort of literary revival kicked off by the recovery of Greek classics in the early Renaissance, but who knows; there might be a movement of people who became convinced that Tolkien's vision was the real history of the world, and identified the "old world" -- that is, our civilization -- with Mordor. I'm not sure they'd be entirely wrong.

FARfetched, if King's saga picks up a steady readership, it's possible. One reason I chose Tolkien's work was that it's been in print for most of a lifetime -- 62 years since the first volume saw print, iirc! -- and it's still hugely popular among a very wide range of readers. Of course it doesn't hurt that Tolkien modeled it on the kind of story that tends to be popular during dark ages.

Don said...

"...there might be a movement of people who became convinced that Tolkien's vision was the real history of the world..."

But surely, if copies of the book survive long enough to spark a literary revival, scholars will read Tolkien's preface and know that it is fiction. Or will they?

RPC said...

Hmmm...and here I'd been thinking that everyone was walking because horses had gone extinct! If horses existed and were reasonably fecund, wouldn't you be seeing some kind of stagecoach service in general existence by now? In, say, rennaisance Europe or colonial America a "stage" was within the means of the middle class (to which your ruinman seems to belong). And you'd have all the plot opportunities of being closeted with a half-dozen or so strangers!
BTW, I've been able to translate all the place names except "Melumi." Given that it's a straight shot from Louisville and that a final destination of Chicago is a plausible cover, I'm guessing Bloomington (Indiana University), but the name change seems a bit of a stretch.
Anyway, great fun!

Rudy

fallout11 said...

Not to be critical (this is a work of fiction after all), but the one thing that continues to bother me personally (sorry, I'm a materials engineer by trade) is the length of time that has passed since the old world ended when compared the durability and functionality of the old world's (poorly made and not meant to last) detritus.

'Modern' formula reinforced concrete structures (we're not talking Roman concrete here) are unsafe ruins within 75 years without continuous upkeep and maintenance. For example, the massive (12 city block) and heavily overengineered Packard Motor Co. plant in Detroit closed in 1956, and today, a mere 55 years later with little or no upkeep, is a legendary crumbling, unsafe, and partially collapsed ruin. Other photogenic examples include the unmaintained forts (museums) of the Maginot Line, Atlantic Wall or Siegfried Line fortifications, Endicott period naval batteries, the battleship-sized slowly collapsing heap that was once Bethlehem Steel's main plant, and the like....in short, some of the most massive and stoutly built structures on the planet.
Rebar long since rusted away to iron oxide stain, concrete shattered, crumbling, turning back to sand. Concrete, like most masonry (including the cement used in brick structures), is quit porous, and freeze-thaw cycles are especially hard on all such materials with low tensile strength.

Many of our "maintained" Interstate highways and especially our bridges (and to a lesser extent our dams) are already in terrible shape, a D- score is often cited.

Within 200 years (assuming nothing is done to maintain/repair), every single non steel truss bridge will be down (and most of those will be unsafe even for foot traffic). Most dams will have failed catastrophically (especially earthen ones), and much of their embayments silted up completely. Every formerly paved road will resemble an arrow straight section of the surface of the moon, although the cleared and leveled rights of way and shoulder areas will likely support and even encourage dirt trading paths to spring up. Every unmaintained wooden framed structure will have rotted away to sawdust. Clothing, leather goods, and the like will be so dry rotted and brittle as to be useless except for careful exhibit behind glass. Firearms not packed completely with grease or cosmolene will be rusted masses more closely resembling those dug up from old battlefields than usable, functioning, safe to operate examples.
Heck, the concrete foundations and slabs of residential houses, shops, and the like are not even reinforced.....they would not yield metal scrap even if laboriously broken up by hand, not that such would be necessary as most residential and commercial real estate slabs are already cracked before the first buyer or tennant even moves in (such is the lack of proper sitework and substandard methods used presently).

Give any of this 400 years, and, well, it will be as if looking for anything from 1600, an studious archaeological dig through the buried remains of a trash pit, rather than a salvage operation.

KevinC said...

Fallout11:

One way to retcon this is to consider that the message papers in the previous installment were dated 2112, if I'm understanding that correctly. If the Old World could still run an array of radio telescopes then (a "pure science" project of the sort sure to meet with budget cuts as money and resources are re-purposed to more urgent matters), the fall of the Old World would be far enough in the future that most of the present built environment will all have been replaced anyway.

If we assume that fossil fuel scarcity starts to bite hard by, say, 2030 (when global oil production will be comparable to 1980 levels if Hubbert's Curve holds), corporations and governments would rediscover an interest in low-maintenance, built-to-last architecture and infrastructure. Unless they're abysmally stupid, which, I suppose, is quite possible. The "bottom line" that currently favors cheap throwaway production (because "better/faster/cheaper" stuff "will" be available in the future) will shift to favor long-lasting, pass-it-down production.

Once it becomes apparent that anything built in the future will be more expensive, more labor-intensive, and lower quality/capability for high-tech items like computers, than anything built today, any item that can be passed on to the kids is more valuable than one that has to be replaced in a few years. So, by the time Star's Reach is shut down and abandoned, most of the present built environment will have been replaced--most likely with structures of re-invented Roman concrete or something better. Some of the other stuff, like papers and cubicle walls might (with a little hand-waving) be imagined as surviving in sealed environments the same way that otherwise perishable items survived in King Tut's tomb.

One thing I do find implausible given the story's premises is that electronic boobytraps and other gadgetry would still work in these ruins. One of the main reasons our world is supposed to be doomed is that it's impossible to effectively store electricity from intermittent renewable sources with enough energy density to run a high-tech civilization. If the "ancients" were able to build hypercapacitors/batteries/whatever that can store electricity for 400 years, it would appear they'd solved that problem.

But that's what the Rule of Cool and the MST3K Mantra are for. :)

And now the obligatory (and well-earned) praise for JMG's writing, and rejoicing at a new installment. You do a terrific job of envisioning this society, and dribbling out the mysteries large and small, concerning Star's Reach itself and how Trey's world became what it is.

Captcha: Shantas--magical being from the North Pole who gives winos presents on Christmas.

KevinC said...

With regard to LOTR, I think it's perfectly plausible that names like "Frodo" "Sam" "Mordor" etc. would remain intact. Our language has changed quite a bit since the King James Version of the Bible was first produced (more so than the changes we see here), but personal and place names like "Jesus" "Matthew" and "Jerusalem" are still the same.

Given its theme, it makes sense to me that LOTR or something like it could be a sacred text in Trey's time. A proto-Priestesshood of Gaia getting started during the collapse would find a pretty handy formative myth in the story of the rise and fall of Saruman. So much so that the Kaskadian Orthodox Church of Gaia might canonize a version with Merry and Pippin as the main heroes, Saruman as the villain, and no Ring or journey to Mordor. The Mome of the Universal Gain Church declares them heretics from her temple headquarters in the canal-city of Orland, and the holy wars begin... :)

On the other hand, it looks like people during the collapse retained knowledge of movable type. IIRC, there are newspapers and handbills in Trey's era, and a printing industry comparable to that of Thomas Paine's time. The preserved government archives of Sisnaddi imply that there was no Zombie Apocalypse followed by an illiterate Dark Age.

If so, fairly accurate abridged versions of LOTR and other famous literature would probably be reasonably common (i.e., in public libraries), and antiquarians and scholars would have accurate full versions. Printing presses greatly reduce the problem of scribal errors.

One little quibble: I doubt they'd be making Aragorn a "Presden." Given a collapse to the 18th Century or before (with a few tech baubles like crystal radio and Geiger counters), I'm pretty sure there would be plenty of warlords and land barons willing to keep the concept of "king" a familiar reality. A story in which "The Return of the King" is the happy ending would be pretty handy for them.

Captcha: Iratrin--are you feeling irritable? Iratrin can help! For just $50.00 a pill, Iratrin can give you back that mellow feeling! Side effects include: genitals falling off, skin melt, and growth of extra eyes. Ask your doctor if Iratrin is right for you.

John Michael Greer said...

Don, the line between fiction and fact is a cultural construct that different cultures draw in different places. Think of Sallust's comment on myths -- "things that never happened and always are."

Rudy, stagecoach service requires frequently repaired roads and a fairly high level of public order, neither of which exist in Trey's time; the same was true in the post-Roman world, of course.

Fallout, that's an interesting point. I spent a fair amount of time around concrete coastal forts built in Puget Sound after the Civil War; there are structural problems after more than a century, but nothing like what you've implied, and I drew on that experience in imagining the collapsed but still salvage-ready cities of Trey's world. Still, of course, this is a work of fiction.

Kevin, the big capacitors (for that's what they are) don't store electricity for 400 years; they're continuously trickle-charged by thermoelectric generators that use nuclear waste as a heat source, as Trey hinted in the second installment. Mind you, those might not last for 400 years either, but I needed a trap with certain qualities for some events in the plot (not all of which have occurred yet) and that was the one that came to mind.

I'm still mulling over the question of what would happen to the names of Tolkien's characters once handed over to oral tradition; the story will probably get an edit once I'm sure of the changes I want to make.

RPC said...

One little proofreading note: I think you used "ford" in one place where you wanted to use "fork" (when Trey and Berry get out of sight of the junction in the road).

jphilip said...

It's a great story and I'm much enjoying it.

and now for the but...
There seemed to me to be a lack of references to two peoples. The first which you have answered in this post was the Europeans that was primarily from history perspective; I figure most Americans know there ancestors came from europe and that europe played a major role in there history george III, WW2 and was the other part of 'The West' if nothing else. Therefore I found it strange that there was no reference to them but an Arab take over could explain the break in relations.

The second and in some ways more puzzling is the lack of any reference to any maritime power. I would have thought that there would be international shipping trade and that some nation or group of nations would end up monopolising it. The people who conducted that trade would be well known, even by people who did/could not buy the precious stone/metals, spices, bulk goods etc.

For Martime power(s) may I suggest the nations of the West Indies. They would have to maintain a fleet of some form to remain in contact with each other and the outside world; yet would not have to spend resources on armys, which the continentals would. Plus their fisheries are probably in a better state than Grand banks etc. so more cause for a boat building industry.
In addition, being poor at present as the large ships of the industrial age start to disappear they will be forced to make alternative arrangements long before more advanced nations do which means they probably wont leave it too late.

Of course that just raises further questions does maritime power equal maritime empire? and if so what form of empire?

My sense of balance likes the idea of Haitian shipping magnates and associated financiers organising palace coups in newinga.

I apologise for the rambling, bad grammar etc., and look forward to the next instalment.

Antony said...

I'm trying to figure out if they are outside of Lebna Tucki, or Lebna Tenisi. Since the left fork led to Luvul, I would guess Tucki, since it is further east. Also, Lebna Tenini is pretty close to Nashul.

John Michael Greer said...

RPC, quite right.

Jphilip, people in Trey's time know about as much about Europe as people in tenth century Europe knew about India -- that is, not very much. As for the West Indies, they're mostly under water in Trey's time -- sea level is about 200 feet higher than it is today -- and the entire region is regularly swept by hurricanes a good deal larger than anything we experience today; both these are impacts of global warming. Maritime trade exists, but it's on a fairly small scale; the economic basis for investing capital into merchant fleets isn't available, and won't be for some centuries.

Antony, they're well up in Tucki, not far from the border with Neeana.

John Michael Greer said...

Finally figured out how the names of Tolkien's characters would get slurred through four centuries or so of oral transmission, by the way, and edited this episode accordingly. From here on in, you can expect occasional references to the adventures of Freddy and Sam.

Neo Tuxedo said...

As for the West Indies, they're mostly under water in Trey's time -- sea level is about 200 feet higher than it is today

I fed that figure to Calculated Earth (which works in metric, so I actually calibrated it for 60 meedas) and got some perspective on Trey's world. You might find it handy for constructing a map, such as Papa Tolkien started with.

(And, because my brain likes to remind me how bad things can get, it came up with this scary query: how significant is the risk that Paolini's Eragon has been incorporated into the legendry of Ergon?)

Thijs Goverde said...

Well, ha-ha, Mr Greer! Tolkien refences? Come now,ou don't fool me for a second! We're in Wolfe country, allright...
Deep in.

One of the things I like about the New Sun books is the sense of strangeness we get from the fact that the protagonist often understands the people he meets much better than we do, and just forgets to explain what - to him - is obvious.

For instance, Trey's meeting with the farmer at the fork of the road would have been just that: a meeting with a farmer, along with some small red-herring-reason for mentioning it.
No hackles up, no mentioning that the man's position at the fork is somewhat suspicious.
And then, a paragraph later, the sudden dash from the road, and the story of Freddy and sam, and then down the pursuing riders, with the farmer amongst them for extra clarity.

Is how Wolfe would have probably done it.
Which is probably why you don't - influences are good, copycatting is bad.
Still, woulda been cool.

jagray said...

Mr. Greer, Thank you for your work. I , for one, very much enjoy the permutations given to things we are familiar with. It keeps some sense of otherworldliness. Reading about Freddy and Sam is simply less jarring and more full of mystery and narrative than the alternative. It is a puzzle to be solved and considered: How many ways can you get from Frodo to Freddy? Since there are an infinite variety of "possible futures," I find this to be most entertaining.
Also, I do believe the biblical names KevinC referenced are all mutations, in fact. But regardless, that is apples and oranges as one is a written tradition, and the other an oral tradition, growing from a culture that has to relearn and reawaken the oral tradition part of the brain. There are certainly examples of oral traditions that have kept stories intact for far longer than written stories that get re-edited every few years, possibly because they are so essential to the culture and are not just "stories," but ways of remembering traditions, ceremonies, dates, culture and geography, etc. but here you are talking about an oral tradition that has sprung up in a very short period, and is trying to reestablish the faculties it has lost and/or which have atrophied. There is an excellent work on this topic called, The Spell of the Sensuous, by David Abram. One of the most moving and enlightening books I have ever encountered. It really breaks open the head, combining nature, breath and language in a truly lush tapestry of beautiful sentences.
I see I'm a little late to the party, but I am really having a good time. Thanks again.